out of curiousity 2? - The "OH NO, not another one!" post

[Orson&Jazz]

Ah thanks Knowles, I understand now; Harry Lime. I have most of the Harry Lime episodes on MP3, but I am yet to finally have a nice, long, quite time to myself to listen to them all. I didn't notice that title on the list of Harry Lime episodes on this website. Would it have had another title? Perhaps an American title? The episodes I have match the titles here on wellesnet, so I guess I have BBC titles.


Well, the pineapple thing. I was reading on another website, and I have come across this in other places as well, it always portrays Orson drinking pineapple juice. I swear I saw this on more than one occassion; there's Orson and somehow he's drinking pineapple juice. I don't know, unless I imagined the whole thing, I assumed Orson was a pineapple juice drinker and it perked my curiousity of course. Why pineapple? Why not apple or orange or even grape juice?


Oh, by the way, as I was mentioning on my last thread, I was curious if Orson's pipes ever came up for auction. Lo and behold I was browsing through eBay, and here I saw some one auctioning off a framed photo of Orson with a cigar included said to have been Orson's own. Needless to say, it piqued my interest. Not quite a pipe, but a cigar nonetheless. How in the hell does one authenticate an Orson cigar?


Glenn, that is quite sad about Orson and Richard's relationship. I don't understand why he tried to conceal it though, or am I reading too much into it. Was Orson embarrassed by Richard, or did he just keep him at a distance for his own safety? I don't quite understand the reasoning behind it.

[NoFake]

Orson& Jazz, I'm not sure if this will help (!), but I think the "Buzzo Gospel" episode was titled "Buzz off with Buzzo"...

NoFake

[colwood]

Orson & Jazz, no this isn't the first topic that I've ever seen locked at Wellesnet. It happens once in a while, usually when a simple question turns into a debate about who's is bigger between two people. Half the time its the same people, but I digress.

If you're interested in books, somebody posted this list a years back, so it doesn't cover the recent releases, but is still an informative list,

http://www.wellesnet.com/cgi-bin....=newbie

Also found this with many interesting bits about all 13 films. The link is an archive site as the original site went down about a year ago,

http://web.archive.org/web....ex.html

Height? I've heard through numerous sources that Welles was actually 6'1" not 4".

Didn't know that he considered the Trial his second favorite. Interesting. Only knew that he considered it his best.

I think Dinnesen was his favorite author. The Immortal Story was actually going to be one part of an anthology movie about Dinnesen stories. But the IS is the only one he could get funding for.

[Glenn Anders]

Yes, colwood. Remember, in This Is Orson Welles, how Welles and Bogdanovich get into a jocular argument about the merits of THE TRIAL. Bodanovich prefers Welles' more populist work, but Welles' defends THE TRIAL stoutly, and I believe, the influence which Brecht had on his conception of it.

No one can know, Orson & Jazz, about that relationship between Welles and his brother, which runs in various guises through a lot of Welles' work, but especially back in that heyday of Freud, as I try to suggest in that review of THE BIG BRASS RING, George Orson Welles would have wondered why he got to go to a special school, and take trips around the World with Dad, and to join a renowned Irish theatrical company while still a teenager, but his brother Richard Ives Welles was being kept in a mental hospital, what were referred to as "snake pits" at the time.

No doubt, too, those who were touting Welles' genius in the late 1930's would have been discomforted that he had a brother suffering from "insanity" -- the bad seed, etc. That discomfit turned to fear in a number of minds, possibly, when the Press got hold of Richard's existence, after he managed one of his occasional releases, and Welles gave him work.

Glenn

[Orson&Jazz]

Colwood, thank you, those links were very helpful. I didn't have time to fully browse through them because they seem quite lengthy, but what I did preview so far seems really great. The one site with the "Essential Orson Welles" seems really interesting! Also, Tony's list of books is excellent!! I had copied and saved it to check each and every book myself. Thanks Tony for the list, where ever you are!!


"Buzz Off With Buzzo"...nope, does not sound like a familiar title. I wish I knew what the equivilant BBC title is to that one. I just might have to go through each episode I have individually to find that specific story line. I am really curious about that particular story now. But no, so far these titles are not the ones that I have. What would be the BBC tilte equivilant for "Buzzo Gospel" or "Buzz off with Buzzo"?


Yes, I see your point Glenn. I guess the public really didn't have the tolerance for those considered 'different' or those that are not quite 'normal'. So, I guess they would be freaked out about Orson's brother. I was glad to know that Orson did care for him any way; supporting him and all. And, I would agree that it must have been some kind of mind job for a young boy to be treated substantially different than the older sibling. I would assume Orson must have been protective of him as well, taking on the role of an older brother, instead of the other way around when he became much older. But here, I am only assuming.

I don't even want to imagine the kind of "cures" they had given to the mentally insane back in those days!! I think they would have been quite barbaric! Was this the time they practiced lobotomies?
:0

[colwood]

If you do a search of the boards here, I think there was a discussion on the "Buzzo" show from sometime last year or so.

[Knowles Noel Shane]

The CORRECT title for "Buzzo Gospel" (I was thinking of the dubious title of the syndicated version) is actually Dead Candidate.

I've a couple sources stating Welles was 6' 4". Don't know if they're correct. Never saw Welles and Wayne together.

I surmised The Trial was Welles' second favourite. He did call it his best until Falstaff came out. Then he called Falstaff his best. I'm equating favourite with best here, something I hate to do, since I can easily tell you my favourite films without being able to tell you which are the best, as that seems to be an academic and deeply researched notion - too many angles to analyze in too many ways and compare.

[Orson&Jazz]

Great Knowles, Dead Candidate is an episode I do have. Now that I know, I am going to listen to it right away. It will definitely cure my curiousity for a bit!


6'1"-6'4", what ever the real height is he is still incredibly tall!


The Trial and Falstaff are movies I have not seen. If they are Orson's favourites, I really want to see them now and see why they make it as his favourites. Now all I have to do is find them!

[NoFake]

Looks like "The Dead Candidate" is indeed a dead candidate -- for the role of the Harry Lime "Mr. Arkadin." I just finished listening to it, and -- though it indeed deals with the Buzzo soft drink (excuse my mistyping of the name in my earlier post as "Happy Lime." Maybe I was imputing alcoholic properties to Buzzo... %-), and Harry's alleged attempt to get the concession for it in a despot-ruled island called Malinia (he claims to have been sent by the U.S. president -- a gut-wrencher, when you think of Welles' ill-fated Ambersons trip), it has nothing to do with Arkadin.

Fortunately, the Lime Arkadin does not have to remain a man of mystery; for that's the name of the episode: "Man of Mystery." I just listened to it...

NoFake

[Knowles Noel Shane]

True, Dead Candidate has NOTHING to do with Arkadin. Those would be Man of Mystery and Blackmail Is a Nasty Word.

[Orson&Jazz]

Wow. Just thought to mention I was reading the "Welles' Career" section of This Is Orson Welles, and seriously, when did this man have time to sleep? From the years 1937-1945, the man was a machine! That is 7 years of continuous work.

If he wasn't doing radio, he was acting in theatre. If he wasn't acting in theatre, he was filming a movie. If he wasn't filming a movie, he was writing something. If he wasn't writing something, he was giving some political speech in god knows where! If not giving a speech, he would be working in radio, and thus the process begins anew!

The man was phenomenal! But you here already knew that! Why he doesn't have a huge following is beyond me!


Also, I am reading Orson Welles Interviews. Can report so far that I hate Hollywood due to "How to Raise a Child: The Education of Orson Welles, Who Didn't Need It." I mean, I already hated Hollywood for what they had done to Orson, but upon reading this particular article, I really, really dislike them. Why all the fuss over a beard? They thought of any idiotic reason just to hate Orson.


How could Orson survive or triumph in place that made an effort not to give him a chance before he even arrived there? They already made plans to dislike him while he was still in the air, and they finalized their plans to hate him before he even got off the plane.

And what makes him even more amazing, is that he still made an effort to make films and work no matter what crap people were throwing at him. The man was resilient.


The whole 99% perspiration thing; I now think that his whole career was 99% perspiration. He really worked for what he wanted, and he worked extremely hard. He worked continuously until his death. I mean, how can anyone have the nerve to think of him as lazy?

???

[Knowles Noel Shane]

Don't forget, the studios did come courting after the War of the Worlds broadcast, and Orson, who wasn't really interested in films, held out until RKO offered him that unbelievable contract. With absolute control as producer and with a guaranteed final cut, he could do what he wanted despite all the filth Variety threw at him. I lament that this contract only pertained to Kane. One account I read stated that Orson allowed RKO to buy him out of the original contract because Kane hadn't made any money for him and, I guess, he wanted to maintain his quality of living. Subsequently he did not have final cut on Ambersons, and we know what happened after that.

I do love Orson for his resilience. No one I've ever heard of was able to just go it alone and self-finance their own films, certainly not during that time frame, and by so doing to come up with such masterpieces as Othello, The Trial, and Chimes at Midnight is even more amazing.

[Orson&Jazz]

Yes, I guess apparently he took the job in Hollywood to make money to invest in his theatre back in New York. Correct me if I'm wrong here. So, he really did not have any intention of actually working in Hollywood.

People are always intrigued by some thing they can't readily have, and Orson was a 'hot' item Hollywood could not readily have.

Of everything I've read so far regarding Hollywood and Orson, I still can not see any justification for the treatment Orson received from Hollywood 'big shots'. Maybe it is because I am biased being an Orson fan, but I still fail to see any reason for their hostility. Jealousy is not a good enough reason.