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La Ricotta (from RoGoPaG, 1963)
Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 6:57 am
by Giano
Hello to everybody, I am new and I am italian, so please do not care of my english.. I start now with this post to find all the informations about Welles in Italy (country that he loved, also a wife!) to help you to expand this great web site. If someone need some particular informations of italian books, dvd, and so on I try to help.
I watched last week all the version of La Ricotta, the Pasolini's episode of RoGoPaG film. In Turin where I live there are the two surviving versions with this differences:
1) in the first the beginning titles are longer,and I say deeper of what Pasolini said about religion;
2) The Welles part is equal, but is different what he says at the end, when Stracci is just dead. In the first he says "Povero Stracci, crepare è stato il suo unico modo di dimostrare di essere vivo" - Poor Stracci, to die has been the only way to demonstrate to be alive; in the second, more significant but censored, Welles says "Povero Stracci, crepare è stato il suo unico modo di fare la rivoluzione" - Poor Stracci, to die has been the only way to make the revolution. Censored, because too close to communist ideas that Pasolini, very very radical, was in touch.
3) Some frames less, when Stracci shakes the dog that has eaten his sandwich.
Moreover, the Film museum of Turin conservates some scenes (about a minute) censored in 1963, I say a part of the strip scene.
This is all remains of La Ricotta, that, I ensure as I have seen italian and english version, is more significant in original language.
Hope it useful to all Wellesnet members.
goodbye Giano
Posted: Tue Jul 04, 2006 5:36 pm
by tony
Welcome, Giano: 
We have been in touch recently with another Italian Wellesnet member in the last few months, Sigi Sciortino, who has been trying to start some enthusiasm regarding the saving of the Don Quixote film, especially the footage that Mauro Bonanni has; so any information you might have on Don Quixote would be appreciated very much by many members.
Here's the URL for the continuing discussion here about Don Quixote:
http://www.wellesnet.com/cgi-bin....2;t=536
In addition to that, personally I'm very interested in the Rosabella documentary directed by Gianfranco Giagni and Ciro Giorgini, which in my opinion is the very best documentary ever made on Welles; I'm not just saying this to be complimentary, as I have said this on Wellesnet before. :;): do you have any information on the making of that documentary?
And of course, any info on Welles's life in Italy is always appreciated here!
Tony
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 6:53 am
by Giano
Hello Tony, personally I have not seen Rosabella but I am sure it is interesting. The director Giagni had a saltuary carrer, from the help of Mauro Bolognini to the creation of musical programmes for Italian television, but he did not succeed to became famous. the other co-director, Ciro Giorgini, has became famous to be one of the most important creators of RAiTv programme "Fuori Orario", that shows forgotten films in late night. I think you know that Giorgini is the director of "Tutta la verità su Mr. Arkadin" (All the truth on mr. Arkadin) shown at Locarno Film Festival last year.
I say that I have found some unseen cortos on Welles here in Italy about his life here. I tell you more next time.
About Don Chishotte, I advise all that the recent DVD appaered here in Italy has more important extras than the French edition.
It is also it far from perfect, but I suggest to al to see it.
Paolo
l
Posted: Tue Jul 11, 2006 9:27 am
by Ste
Belated greetings to Giano.
I have never seen RoGoPaG, or La Ricotta, but I am interested in doing so. Is there an affordable DVD available anywhere (preferably with either English audio or subtitles)? The only one I can find is this rather expensive French boxed set.
As for Don Quixote, I can find no details at all on the new Italian DVD. Can you post an online link to it, please, Giano? My cyber-travels did turn up this new French edition, but despite a release date of 23 June, it hasn't turned up on any of the French e-tailers' websites yet.
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 6:57 am
by Giano
Hello Ste, I have read on this site tha Criterion dvd of Pasolini's Mamma Roma has La Ricotta as extra, but you have to check on Criterion dvd web site. In Italy there is no dvd.
About Don chishotte, this is the link:
http://www.ermitage.it/prodott....tto=117
The ermitage label has been always a bad label, specialized in low cost dvd and low quality, but according to them, this is the first dvd with higher vision and extras..I do not know. Good that also in France is coming out a new edition.
ps I have a divx video of La Ricotta, but I cannot send you because I have not the fast connection at moment. We can arrange to change between us dvd, or wait for fast coonection from me. Tell me what you think.
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:37 am
by Ste
Many thanks for that, Giano. I don't know how I missed La Ricotta being on the Criterion DVD of Mamma Roma ... must've been snoozing when that one was announced. I shall make it a priority purchase this week.
The Don Chisciotte DVD sounds interesting, but I fear the extras will not be subtitled. My Italian is, quite frankly, non-existent, although I have visited your beautiful country several times. (Congratulations, btw, on Italy's victory in the World Cup. I am from England originally, so I watched every match.)
Posted: Wed Jul 12, 2006 11:58 am
by Ste
On a wider note, this topic raises an issue that has been on my mind a lot lately: the level of hard information available on the main WellesNet site. The film section is particularly out of date. Are there any plans in place to address this issue, Tony?
I lost my entire DVD collection last year in Hurricane Katrina. WellesNet was the first place I turned for the necessary information to rebuild the OW section, and hopefully make it bigger and better than before. But in the end it was other websites -- criterionforum.org, DVDBeaver, even Amazon -- that proved to be the most useful.
I don't mean to put WellesNet down. It is a terrific resource, but increasingly one has to search the message board for snippets of information that can easily be missed -- such as the above La Ricotta situation. Surely this shouldn't be so. I fancy the majority of visitors to WellesNet do not read the message board at all. This doesn't necessarily mean they are minor fans -- interested only in Citizen Kane -- to be ignored. If we are serious about increasing OW's profile on the Web, WellesNet should embrace fans of all interest levels, and provide them with up-to-date, easy-to-access information.
Recently, I have been delving deeper into OW's acting work -- an area that, for me, used to begin and end with The Third Man -- and trying to pick up as many official DVDs as I can. The WellesNet message board has been useful in this regard, but, again, the main site is woefully out of date. Comments like "available on video" are not adequate in 2006. People need to know details of different versions, artwork, labels and catalogue numbers, countries of origin, languages, bonus features, etc.
Obviously, this is a large undertaking for someone, but it is essential, I feel, for the future of WellesNet. There must be many forum members with bigger OW collections than mine (34 official DVDs and counting), but I am willing to contribute whatever information I can.
Your obedient servant,
Ste
Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 1:41 pm
by tony
Ste:
As Larry and I are only doing News updates on the blog and have nothing to do with the web-site itself (other than our own postings), I contacted Jeff regarding your criticism: he has suggested that If people want to update the video info, then members can start a thread solely dedicated to DVD releases, and include the following information: title (with foreign title if applicable), releasing company, date of release, catalog number, run time, extras, and any other pertinent information. If they have a scanner and can provide a scan of the cover, that would be helpful as well.
And since you have been the first to volunteer, Ste, I happily recommend thet you start this thread. :;):
Tony
Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 2:55 pm
by Ste
Tony: I prefer to think of it not so much as criticism, rather a positive suggestion with one eye on the future. I would hate to see WellesNet go the way of so many other film and music websites i.e. functioning in theory, but not in practice.
Well, I guess I've talked myself into it, haven't I? 
Okay, give me a couple of days and I'll start it off. I don't have a scanner, but I should be able to steal most of the cover art from other sites.
How do other members feel about this project? The silence so far is discouraging, I must say. Would you like to see a comprehensive catalogue of Welles DVDs? Is the message board all that matters? Opinions, please!
Posted: Thu Jul 13, 2006 3:19 pm
by tony
If you build it, they will come.
:;):
Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 5:07 am
by ToddBaesen
Ste:
I like the idea you propose very much, and think it could be a great resource, so please let me encourage you to start a threat for Welles DVD's.
Obviously, once the thread is started, and people from different countries contribute what they know about variant Welles DVD's, the information could be easily converted to an updated entry on Wellesnet main pages.
What I find particuarly facsinating, is that there are now documentaries about Welles specific work in three European countries: Italy (Rosabella) Spain (Brunnen) and Yugoslavia (The Other Side of Welles). And of course, in Brazil, if you count It's All True.
Posted: Fri Jul 14, 2006 9:05 am
by tony
"What I find particuarly facsinating, is that there are now documentaries about Welles specific work in three European countries: Italy (Rosabella) Spain (Brunnen) and Yugoslavia (The Other Side of Welles). And of course, in Brazil, if you count It's All True."
Todd: that's fascinating! Perhaps you would like to research those 4 films and post the info (though I've just heard that "The other side of Welles" is not from Yugoslavia, but from Croatia).
We all appreciate your support.
:;):
PS: there's a post of mine that's just been revived by Francois: "What's the best Welles documentary ever?"
If you want, why not turn that into a special thread for Welles documentaries info? I've already posted some info and a link on "Brunnen" there. :laugh:
Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 6:59 am
by Giano
Hello, about Brazil, nobody have seen Rogerio Sganzerla's 4 works for Welles period in Brazil during it's all true? Somebody told that Sganzerla "Nem tudo es vertade" is the best documentary of one director to another director! As I have seen it, I say to agree.
Giano
Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2006 9:53 pm
by tony
Giano: I have "All is Brazil", but without English subtitles, so I showed it to a Brazilian couple I know, and they couldn't understand it either!
Jeff says it's "non-linear". :;):
Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2006 5:45 am
by Giano
Hello Tony, I agree that All is brazil is not the best, simply because it is a not useful ripetition of Nem tudo es vertade (it's not all true), and this is the worst, use pieces of the first documentary! The other are Lenguagem de Orson Welles (not seen), Welles no rio (dated 1977, but very misterious), and the beginning of O signo do caos.
However, I have seen it with italian subtitles, and it is perfect...
Giano